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Dan Williams's avatar

Great post. I guess as a non-expert, my sense is that the evidence of hunter-gatherer lifestyles is so weak and uncertain, the ideological biases are so strong and almost entirely in one direction (in Fry's cases the desired conclusion is pretty explicit if I remember correctly), and the space for social scientists to select, frame, interpret, etc, results in biased ways is so vast that I don't have much confidence in any conclusions in this area. Another question I have is what is really at stake in disputes about the rate of violence among hunger-gatherers. Even if it's true that the rate of violence is relatively low, it doesn't follow that humans aren't "naturally" violent, competitive, etc. It might just be that with extremely small scale mobile subsistence societies violence doesn't generally pay in terms of expected value. That story would predict that when the incentives change, people can quickly become much more violent, which the history seems to support. Anyway, just some thoughts that occurred to me whilst reading. Thanks!

Some guy's avatar

Thanks for this post, which is both interesting and useful. I look forward to reading your two articles.

I will mention that, in some ways, Pinker can be his own worst enemy. If you read the preface and Intro to the book (which lots of people do), you get the impression that when it comes to warfare, he’s arguing for ultra-steep declines in rates, analogous to homicide and execution; but f you read the chapter on Great Power wars (which apparently few people do), the actual claim is much weaker (trendless fluctuation).

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